The Red Pill Is Not the Only Option with Rayviation

Before we start, this episode was recorded live at 105.5 FM Lumpen Radio, where noseyAF goes live on the air every second and fourth Saturday of the month.What you're hearing is the conversation as it happened.No edits, no retakes.Still curious and very fun, but honestly, sort of scary.So settle in and enjoy this conversation on Nosy af.Gotta get up, get up to the whole world.You a winner, winner, vision of a star with a mission in the cause what you doing, how you doing, what you're doing and who you are?Flex yourself and press yourself Check yourself, don't wreck yourself if you know me then you know that I be knowing what's up.Hey, Stephanie.Graham is noseyAF WLPNLP&HD1 Chicago 105.5 FM Lumpen radio, y'.All.Welcome to Saturday.Welcome to Lumpen.It is so warm outside.It is unseasonally warm.I feel like we can go to the community pool, which I love, right?

And wouldn't you know, all of the high school lifeguards are in school, so the pools are drained.So what are we to do?

What are we to do?I mean, I guess we can go to the lakefront, but I'd rather be at a community pool, if I can say so myself.

You know what?Yes, same.

Y'.All.We are joined in the studio with Raviation, a Chicago based producer, filmmaker, playwright, and teaching artist whose work explores community culture and social change.Raviation, welcome to noseyAF here on Lumpen.

I am honored to be here, Stephanie.Thank you so much for inviting me.

Yes.I'm excited to talk about all of the films that you've done.You have the call to Harper Studio, behind Harper Studio Vintage, and of course, the one we all love so much, Loving men.

Yes.

Well, we love them all, but yes, Loving men.

But Loving men, right?Indeed, indeed.

Oh, my goodness.So let's see.So you do all of these things.Do you have a favorite?Does one inform the other?How do you think about your multitude of practices?

Wow, that's an excellent question.I would say the one that I have the most fun with is teaching artistry, Right?It's like the one where I'm like, okay, I can come up with the activities, whether that is puppet building, whether that's creating a stand up comedy special, mockumentaries, all these other kind of things.I really do enjoy teaching youth, especially middle schoolers through high schoolers, what I know, but also what they can also do, especially at that age, too.And it's always really interesting around youth film work, specifically because a lot of the adults in the room have a feeling of like, oh, well, they must wanna talk about this or that or do this.And after, I'm like, actually, y', all, I'm in the classroom with them.They love horror films.

Oh, wow.

I don't know what is going on in their TikTok Algorith, but something about it is just saying, like, yes, slasher films, clown films.And I'm like, fascinating, but let's make it happen.

That is hilarious.Kids are the future.Sure are.And if they're about to churn out horror films, well, I guess this is the season for it, at least.

Exactly.And because they are the future, we do have to teach them how to read.

Yeah, we certainly do.Oh, my gosh.I was just talking to.Maybe it was another interview I did where they were suggesting they're like, hey, if you ever get a kid, you know, tell them to go get a book and read to you.That's like, what we can do.It's just community members.

That's right.

When you're deciding, deciding what story you want to tell, what makes you think, okay, this is something I want to talk about?

That's a great question.I would say that for all of the films that I've made, a lot of one, the criteria is, like, the topic has to find me.

You know what I mean?

Like, there's a certain kind of attraction that I have to have there.But another thing that I love in a good story is when it seems simple on the surface, but it actually has a lot of complex layers going on to it.Right.The first documentary that I put out into the world was called Days of Division, and it was about the civic civil war that erupted over the Lowell High School in Massachusetts, my hometown, over either keeping the existing site downtown and doing renovations or building entirely new over in the affluent neighborhood of town.Right.And the best way I'm able to describe that for people who weren't there during that particular time was imagine the 2016 national election between Trump and Hillary, but concentrated on a local government scale between people who wanted the high school to either remain downtown or over at Colley Stadium, which is where it was proposed to be built over in Belvedere.Right.Yeah.As soon as people.And it's so funny, too.Cause again, this was a college project as well, too.

Right.

So we're getting really deep into this thing, and I'm.I'm looking crazy to my other two classmates who are not from Lowell.Right.And just like, red string, cork boards, like, the whole nine.And I'm like, okay, well, this person said this and this person said that, and there's all these different interest groups that are convening together.And then I remember my friend and collaborator on this project was just like, it's just a high school, right?Why is it this deep?It's just like, oh, no.But we're talking about the.Who has the power within local government, right?Like, whose interests are actually being served within city hall, right?Like, and all of these other various things.Is it better for the taxpayer?Is it better for the students?Is it all these other kind of things that come up within that at the same time, too?And it goes forward and reveals all of the other problems that are sort of festering underneath Lowell that we try to hide with the folk festival, right?

School politics is such a wild thing.And because I don't have children, I don't pay attention to it.But I know with, like, midterms coming up, I was talking to parents, like, who all are y' all behind with all this stuff, right?And some folks were talking about how people who enter, like, school politics are using it as a stepping stone for their, like, quote, unquote, real political career.And I'm just like, what?I didn't know about that.It's just bizarre.That's not what we're here to talk about today, but I just feel like it's a whole other wild lane.

Absolutely, absolutely.

Don't forget to vote, y'.All.

Don't forget to vote.

Register, please, and get yourself set up for success.

Right.

Oh, my gosh.Well, let's talk about Loving Men, which.What a wonderful film.

Thank you.

A circle of men speaking about emotions, experiences, and sort of like a, well, not judged way.Did I explain it right?

Yes.

Did I do a good logbook?

Yes, yes, absolutely.That film, it really means so much to me.It was one of the films that actually got me more enmeshed within the Boston community.Right.Like, the partner organization that we did this with was the Boston UOJIMA Project, who actually spawned the idea of, like, hey, we want.We're already a part of some of these men's circles, healing circles, et cetera.And we want to show and model what that is going to be on film.Right.As a part of their All About Love assembly that was had a couple of years back.So it is so truly near and dear to my heart.I will say at this period of time, it's my best work.I hope I didn't peek too soon.But if I did it with this film.

Yeah, you're just getting started.

I'm proud.

Thank you.How did you get everyone to speak so vulnerably?So maybe let's sort of describe it for our listener who's out there maybe practicing their runs for the Chicago Marathon tomorrow.Let's sort of paint the picture of what do they see?

Sure, sure.So when you first watch Loving Men, you're entered in on the Roxbury neighborhood of Boston, one of the keystone black neighborhoods of Boston.

Okay.

And we had it take place at Black Market Nubian.And it's a community center.It's like a multi use center.And for this particular purpose, we had gathered multiple people from different men's groups, some non binary, some hehim, et cetera, from different cultures, different races, different generations, all of these other kind of things together.And we open it up, of course, with a meditation.Right.Like before, like there's also like some fellowship.Like there's a building of an altar that has like pieces of all of the participants within the film to put a piece of them together of like, to just be able to center the space.

Okay.

And then from there we get into questions around how do men show love?What gets in the way of that?And how through these circle groups, can we get to a point of being able to take down these walls of patriarchy that actually bind us all?Even though a lot of people would see men as the beneficiary of them, and they would be in a lot of instances.But people also within these circles don't necessarily see how patriarchy is also a prison for them, how it's also a limiting factor for them.And there's so many great things that are said by all of the people who came together in this space because they knew that more of this kind of conversation needs to be happening.

Right, I see.Yeah.

And there's.And again, truly like all of the trigger warnings for Loving Men too.Look again.Beautiful film.Beautiful film.But people are also being very raw and vulnerable about the things that they've experienced within this life.

Right.

And it's one thing to do that with people that you know kind of well and that you feel like could actually hold a space for that and all that good stuff.But it's also another thing to do that with four cameras in the room and a big boom pole right over it too.But they knew that that conversation by them speaking up, that would be the gateway or the permission that people need.I think that people, but also men generally and specifically, they need permission in order to feel these things or to know that it's okay that I can drop the act or I can drop the walls that are being put up for protection at the same time, too.It's very, very much like a turtle in that particular way.But, you know, the turtle can't eat or receive sunlight if it's just always within its shell.So what can we do to make that turtle more comfortable?

Right.Yeah.And so in the film, it's like these.Everybody is sort of being a model for the viewer, so we could sort of replicate this ourselves.And is there.Well, I guess maybe not necessarily for the film, but when these circles happen, I'm assuming there's some sort of Kona silence.Right.We can't just see you on the street.Oh, that's Rae Sahm, who was telling us.Is that your mom you were telling us about?

You know, it's funny.Like, I'm not sure exactly, like, how all of the participants are within this, but again, a lot of them are activists.A lot of them are known within their relative circles, whether that be in Boston, Philly, New York, California, like, wherever it might be.Right.Like, some people are like, oh, we recognize them as a figure within the community that is already speaking about these issues, that's already doing youth work on some level or such.And they're also really great in just being like, hey, there could never be too much of these particular groups together.So as much as people want to hold them as a model or perhaps on a pedestal, I don't think anybody would really be comfortable with that and being like, hey, well, can we invite you into the circle?Or can we give you all the tools to be able to start your own circle and come off from that as well?And yeah, yeah.

How has.Since the film has been out, how's it been, like, received?How are you?Loving it.Sharing it?

Yeah.Oh, man.There's been so many different ways that we've launched this film.Right.Like that.First, when we originally finished it, we had a.It was part of, like, the assembly that the Boston Yojima project was putting together.And we had our first public screening, one at Black Market Nubian, where the film was actually filmed itself.Right.

Oh, cool.

But then we also had it at a nature center.Right.Like, to this day, I do not believe that Loving Men has been shown in a traditional theater environment.And I love that.

Sure.

Like, it actually leans more and is more useful for us to kind of get out of this mode of like, oh, yeah, this is A popcorn film.And good for these people for engaging in this practice, but this has nothing to do with me.

Right, right, right.

So in that same instance, like, the film has been received, like, I would say, like, quite well for the people who have seen it.You know what I mean?Like, Boston Uojima project, like, they're, they're well known, they can draw a crowd, right?And then those people can draw in really good people.And I've had amazing conversations, like, not just with men, but with mothers, with brothers, with people who, frankly, in my life, like, I didn't think that they would actually respond well to the material because of like, some of them, like, what's going on there?They're like, oh, well, I don't approve of this person, or this person might be doing this or doing that, but because they're actually being honest in naming these struggles that men might either feel around loneliness or vulnerability or not being able to really express themselves in that way, they're like, oh, like the red pill is not the only option.Right?Like that, that manosphere realm is not the only option that we need to take people in.And I would say, as far as reception goes, of course we have our platform where we're actually able to see who's watching this film, who's renting it, what places can actually do these things.So it's great in that regard.Right.But we also need to be doing more.Right?I would need to.It's my life's mission, truly, to be able to sit down more and more men, to be able to see these conversations take shape and to see how they evolve within that and then think like, differently about, like, oh, well, maybe I'll talk to my son differently.Right?Like, I think that something that has been the most surprising factor of just like our audience, when again, like, you're filmmaking, you're thinking about like, oh, who's the audience for this?Who is the audience for this?Right.You would want a lot of people to see your film, but who's it going to be?But mothers, I would say, like, are our biggest supporters of this film because so many of them are thinking like, oh man, like, I might be in a single parent home or I'm raising this boy or these boys.And I see all of the pitfalls that again, within the pathway of being a masculine person or being a gay person, et cetera, like, whatever it is, right?There isn't a model for what that looks like within the home.And there is a lot of pitfalls that go over when people are Themselves.

Right.

When they're out in the world, but also when they're going against the grain of something at the same time too.Right.So I've had like beautiful, like tear jerking conversations with mothers who are like, thank you for giving me this.Like, I'm gifting this to my son immediately.

Yeah.Oh my gosh.It just gives me like tickles in my stomach to be like, oh my God, if I was a parent, it just seems so overwhelming.But thankfully we have.I mean, even with loving many, it comes with a watch guide.Is that okay to share the watch guide that comes along with it?So it's like you have these conversations that can help you do this work at home, in your, you know, community, church, whatever say you.So you're not leaving us just.Thanks for coming.Right?

Yes.We were really being intentional about that for sure.So thank you for mentioning that.

Yeah, that's really wonderful.And how did the film.You want to talk about, like the distribution platform, the Kinema.Kinema.Let's talk about that.Because I thought that when I watched it, I watched the film on Kinema, it was such a beautiful experience.Can you talk about that platform just for like other filmmakers?If you are a filmmaker, hear about this one.So go ahead, please.

Thank you.I would say that a lot of people would be like saying, sounding the alarm bells, that there's no money in indie filmmaking and there's no way to get our films to our audiences and this and that.But I truly do believe that we are in a golden age of indie filmmaking.And it's not just because we have a plethora of streaming platforms to choose from, but because we have a platform specifically like Kinema that really is empowering when you're.Especially when you're doing documentary impact work.Right.

Okay.

Kinema is a platform that again, collects like a lot of different films, both features, shorts, etc, across like all different spectrums, like worldwide, can be submitted from Kinema.I believe it also goes through a selection process at the same time too.So your film does have to be of say, like festival quality or of sort.Right.Or at least something that's like, okay, yeah, it doesn't have like just a bunch of unnecessary profanity or anything like that's like a little uncouth or whatever.Right.But something I love about the platform is that we can put it out in a multitude of different ways.Because something that I had with Days of the Vision, right.That when I took it on the road around just the Massachusetts area, we went into libraries, went into churches and just anywhere that would have us.Right.But no one was going like, oh well, what's your licensing fee?Or what is even the apparatus for you to track with the people who are actually watching your films here?People who actually did the thing RSVP'd and showed up.Right.Those emails are so much more precious than a social media follower count.

Definitely.

Because it's like, hey, I want to invite you out specifically with this.Right?So Kinema, when you're able to put your film out there, you're in and say like, oh, we want to rent this, but we also want to make it accessible.Like that was something that myself and the Uojima project were being like very intentional about.So again, there is a sliding scale for how much you want to know that.

That's really cool.I love sliding skill.

Yes.Like pay what you can, you know, pay what you want, you know, so, so that's, that's, that's like the thing there.But also when, if you say, if you're an organizer, right, or sorry, if you are a person that's at a business or a local church or anything like that, you yourself can make a Kinema account and look at all of the selection of films that are on there and be able to, based off of like your ticket sales or based off of like the amount of audience that you think they're going to come in there, actually be able to pay like that one time licensing fee.Like Kinema has like all of the things packaged up.It also has like other protections like other streaming services do.So like no one could just go through and like pirate your film or do all this other kind of stuff.So there's a lot of good protection that's also on there at the same time.And as we're building up like this audience list of people who are like, yeah, we love seeing loving men here.We can do this in person.Right.There's also a virtual option as well.So you can do something that's either video on demand or something that's like a sync screening.Right.You could also do a virtual talk as well.

Oh, no way.

There's, there's so many cool things on that platform that just make it like so amenable to a film like this, which is the whole ethos of it is gathering like the real magic and the depth that we can get to emotionally when we gather around and talk to each other and just get into it.

Well, I love that so much because, you know, one might think, you know me, that, oh, let me Put my project up on YouTube and go and call it a day.It's like, no, you got other.There's other options, you know, especially if you're trying to be a professional about it or program your own projects.It's nice to know that there's other resources that.That you have accessible to you.Yeah, yeah.Which is great.Oh, my gosh.You know, with Loving Men, this is like a film that could be your life's work.Right.But you obviously have other interests.We're all multi dimensional people.You have other interests.How do you break apart from that?So, like, even coming into.What's the Melvin project?

Ooh, yes.There is the.

What's the name of it?

Oh, yes.The Call to Harper Studio.

Yeah.The Call to Harper Movie.Yeah.

That is the feature documentary that I'm currently in pre production for about my favorite vintage store in the city of Chicago, Harper Studio.Vintage.And the story of the sole proprietor, Melvin Thompson.Okay.

Okay.

Yes.And I also had a short film that actually predates that.Right.Essentially called My Call with Melvin, which is a film based on the film.

That's what I was thinking of.Yes.My Call with Melvin.Yeah.So, like, my question is, like, how do you, you know, I guess get time to break off and like, work on other projects when, you know, there's a film like Loving man that is so like, you know, we need to change the world.

Yeah.Stephanie, you.

Is this like your side job, you know, a client, the Belvin project or.

Right, yeah.No, you're asking the right questions here.And this is.It's so hard with film like this too.And especially Loving Men, like, I do put it like this.I think it is so helpful that I'm not in this project alone.You know, like two of the executive producers, Gio Costamiris and James Van Boyd Jr. Like, they're still with the Ubasa Nujima Project and are still very much actively within the work of it.

Okay.

Partnering with other organizations to organize screenings.And we've.For years now, actually, since the film has gotten on board again, I don't work for the Boston New Jima project at all, but it's this thing where it's great because those are truly my brothers.You know what I mean?We've come so close over this time.And whether it's about film festival submissions, whether it's about me doing my research around, just like, oh, well, what platforms would be best utilized for these things too?There are a lot of people who care about Loving Men, the film who were involved in the inception of it or are just really big fans of it as an audience member and want to share it with more other people.So to me, the film belongs to the world now.Right.And any place that the world would like to have me and be like, hey, can you add more context?Or could you bring us through this and that?I'm available.You know what I mean?But I can't be everywhere.And another thing, with Loving Men.On that particular project, I was the producer and the editor.Right?

Right.

And I always felt like I would say comfortable within that role because those are the swords that I started to sharpen, especially at the old job that I used to have.And I'm like, I'm really good at, again, the logistics of actually organizing things and doing this and that.But then also the executing.Right.But then the production side, I'm like, I enjoy it, but it's somebody else's job to be a director.It's somebody else's job because they have a vision and this and that.I've always felt like, oh, yeah, I want to support a person in bringing a vision to life.But with my call with Melvin, and again, I'm headed to Harper Studio.Truly, you got me.Right?

Right.Yeah.Rayviation is in the studio looking jazzy out.

I just gotta say, appreciate it with that particular film.Again, it was like what I had said earlier, like, that found me.I did not go into that store thinking, like, oh, this is gonna be the next documentary project that I have here.But within the call that I had with Melvin that I made into the short film, I'm like, oh, wait, There's a lot of interesting depth here with this question.And there's so much within Melvin's story that I also relate to.Right.Like his just this idea of this one item, this one experience, this couple of days, whatever it is that can completely change your life and think I need to uproot all of the stability that I've been building over the past however many years and just go and chase this thing because I'm being called to it.Right.That's truly how I feel about the call to Harper Studio and about sharing the story about just such an amazing person and such an amazing store that is preserving Midwest fashion history.Right.And just all of.And also community history and just being able to break out of the mold of just like what Chicago segregation has always been known to be by a person who has, in his old life.Right.Or race in his first life, always was fighting against that, you know what I mean?Always working to say, like, how can we bring more investments down over to the south side and the west side, right, where we're seeing all this neglect happen.

I learned even from, you know, the short piece that you have available that you share with me, where in the film he talks about just making it easy for yourself, like, where he was like, hey, I want to start this store on the south side.But then he had, like, the west side.They're like, hey, make it easy.You know, like, let's go and, like, build your audience up for first before you move someplace else and you're fighting against all these things.And it made me think, like, oh, yeah, like, you know, in our soft life era, moving with ease, you know, Trisha Hersey, you know, yesterday, rest is resistance.Like, how can we make things easy to build up and then move forward?And another thing that came up, I think that I've thought about getting to know your work is just about relationships, like, keeping up relationships.Because you'll see in, you know, maybe other documentaries or other films where the filmmaker will.They'll spend all these time with folks release the film won't, like, say anybody on air, but, like.And then they're gone.And you go back to the subjects and they're like, oh, yeah, we only met them that one time when they came.And, you know, and they.Yeah, like, you feel used, right?So it's like, it seems like when you do these projects that you're making, you know, like, you refer to the other producer as your brothers.Like, you are, like, building an extended family.Yes, yes.

100%.100%.

Yeah.That's really cool.So what is.What is Harper.Harper Studio?Vintage, right?What is that place?Like, like, how did you even.Just really quick get into vintage?

Sure.I would say that when I first moved to Chicago, right, I was still, of course, getting my bearings, like, knowing what's around.And I'm like, okay, yeah, like, I, again, I had to literally start my life from scratch.I had to rebuild my wardrobe and all that good stuff, too.But I'm like, okay, I can do that here.And there was a time that I had gone down to OTV and they had this cool coworking session that was going on.I was still working on Loving Men and the poster and all that other good stuff.And then I invited my good friend Nia Scott to the event, and then she was like, yeah, yeah, I'll see you there.It'll be cool.And then got there mad late.You know, just like, we're packing up all of the stuff.And then, like, she's so late, and we're just like, I still want to hang out with you.So we were just walking around the neighborhood, and Aphrah, I'm like, oh, yeah, we go to this art gallery and go to the grocery store, et cetera, et cetera.And then she asked me like, oh, have you ever been to Harper Studio Vintage?Like the vintage store on North Ave. And Aphra, I'm like, oh, yeah, I've been to this one other vintage store, but I thought it was fine.And she was like, no, no, no.I'm talking about the one right around the corner.I'm like, I had no idea there was one right around the corner.So.So we walk in and Melvin is there, and he's like, oh, it's your first time at Harper Studio.And then he rings a bell.

Oh, I love you know what I mean?

I'm like, this is an eccentric guy.But then also looking at the store itself, I was just like, wow, this place is amazing.And then I'm just looking through the stuff, and I'm like, it just feels like your black grandma's house, but cool.You know what I mean?And cool and cool.It's just that version of it.And there's just, like, really interesting artworks and homeware and decor and this and that.And after, I'm like, wow, this is so cool.And then I swear, when I walk in a Harper Studio vintage, I feel like Neo in the Matrix.I'm seeing the ones and the zeros.

I love it, love it.

So I'm like, wait a minute.This is really cool.But then there's also this, and then there's also that and this and that.And then I put together this yellow suit ensemble, which I will share with you during the break.And it was the first thing that I ever bought from Harper Studio.And I walked out of the changing room, and they were like, wow, that just fits you perfectly.I've always had an old soul, really have identified with the 70s and this and that.And that's Melvin's era, you know what I mean?He's just like, I specialize in this.So that was the start of a vintage addiction that only could be satisfied by Harper Studio because nowhere else in the city has it like him.And it was also a thing where, as I was going through and finding out, oh, well, this place has to be packed with this, that, the other thing.And he's just like, ray, like, no, you know what I mean?He's like, I've Been, I believe next week on October 16th or 18th or so is the 10 year anniversary of Harper Studio Vintage.Being on that block, being open and having all this stuff and it's such a testament because no one expected him to last that long out there.You know what I mean?

That's wonderful.Yeah.

And it's amazing.It's amazing stuff.

That's amazing.Congratulations to him.That's like not an easy feat, you know, just coming off of, you know, interviewing all of these black business owners for August of Black Business Month, I feel such a, you know, I guess, kinship to business ownership, entrepreneurship.Because I feel like it is just like running a practice and the longevity in it is.Yeah, not for the week.

No.Yeah, definitely not.And to do it in a way that also brought people together, Right.Like, it's one thing to just like sell a product and have a good quality thing that keeps people coming back, but I, every time I walk in a Harper Studio, I feel like I get a chance to know my neighborhood better.Right.I get to know other people and other artists because Melvin is just such a wonderful connector in that way and just has a propensity for these things.And I'm just like, it just gives me such a deeper appreciation of what's here.But then also this other thing, I'm like, why aren't more things like this at the same time?And also something that is the biggest flex that I've ever heard from a business owner, especially a solo preneur.Right.Ten years operating, no returns.

Yeah.Wow.

No return.He really makes sure that if that is something for you, that's gonna be for you.He'll hold onto it, he'll do the thing.And then if it's not right, he'd be like, ah, maybe not.But Melvin really will look out for you.Whether, like you're a longtime customer, a first time customer, like, that's what it is.

I love it, y'.

All.

We are here with Rayviation, but we gotta take a quick break, so we'll be right back.Real Talk, how many opportunities have you bookmarked and never applied to?I know I have.And you know what?It happens.The admin part of the work we're doing is understandably boring and tedious, but when you neglect it, it can cost you real opportunities.That's why I created Artist Admin Hour, because behind every exhibition is a clear budget submitted.That makes sense.Admin is the flex.It's the work that makes the work work.But you don't have to do it alone.Every Wednesday, 7 to 9pm Central Artists show up on Zoom to tackle what we've been avoiding.Residency applications, grant apps, budgets, invoices, whatever's on your list.Two hours of body doubling with structure.No shame in real community, 25 to 45amonth gets you in.But if that's not doable, email me because getting this done is very important.We will make it work.Stop letting admins sabotage your practice.Join us today at artist admin hour.com.Wlpn&hd1 Chicago 105.5 FM Lumpedin radio, y'.

All.

We are here with Raviation.I love your name, by the way.

Thank you.

Thank you.It's such a wonderful.It makes me smile.Wonderful.

Thank you.

So, as a teaching artist.Oh, no, wait, I will wait.I mean, take this back.

Okay.

No, I do want to go there.As a teaching artist, you spend time helping people think creative.Creatively and communicate your ideas.And now with the social media, that's what I want.I was so curious about with your.The social media environment where everybody is creating content, everybody's trying to get attention, and sometimes it feels like we're making things just to feed the algorithm.Do you ever feel like that?Yes.

And it's a complex thing, I find.

Right.

Because I think on one hand, if you are.Well, actually, I'll start with this.I do think that there is an art to doing content creation.Right.I think that there is an art.I hate that name, you know?I know, right?Yes.Because that's the thing, too.It's a very specific way that you either have to talk to the camera or talk to people or do all this kind of stuff.Because the.It's an unhealthy thing as an artist to know exactly when a person was uninterested in something that you had on your heart and wanted to say and put out into the scrolling ether that is happening right between cupcake recipes and.Yeah, dogs.Exactly.So in that regard, I'm just like, okay, this.It's such a weight on you.Right.And it's also one of those things too, where I'm like, oh.Then you get this thing where they're like, oh, well, you know, you have to edit off of this app if you actually want your video to go a little bit more viral within this.Because that.Because they're trying to promote this on their own platforms.And I'm like, okay, I edit for a living.I show people how to edit.I do all of these things and sometimes I get to my own personal projects.But at the end of the day, I'm just like, I don't wanna open this anymore.You know what I mean?It's exhausting in that way.And that's why a lot of people are like, well, we can just outsource all of this stuff to AI.And then you see on the other side of things, like how people react to the flyers, right?And how people are able to immediately suss that out, right?So on one hand, people want authenticity.Like, I even have some stipulations about that.Like, if people really want something authentic or if they think that they do.And in that same regard, too, it's like this.It is where the audience is, right?Like, frankly, it's how I found about your show, right?I was just like, oh, I found out about Lumpen Radio a little later in life here too.But it's one of those things where I'm like, oh, this is really cool.People who I followed, who actually bring people out in real life have been on your show, right?And the soon I started digging through your archive and through your episodes.I'm like, oh, this is such an amazing program.You know what I mean?

This is really cool.

And so in that regard, it is where our kind of digital town square is for any particular given area, but also at the same time, these algorithms, again, in the X, many people that you're following, are you seeing all of their stuff?You know what I mean?Something that might weigh really heavy on the hearts of a lot of artists or who are trying to put themselves out there and feel like they're getting somewhat of a lackluster response to it, is they might not be giving your painting a chance with all of the people that actually follow you because they're trying to do something that's going to keep them on the app longer.And if your art was deemed by the algorithms, et cetera, as something that was not going to keep a person's attention for that long, then they're just not going to show it.And at that rate, where do you place the validation?Right?And that's why I'm like, content creation can just become a thing that sort of poisons the mind, you know what I mean?And just poisons just like, oh, how you even think about presenting your artwork.And you're like, oh, well, I have to do this sliding with the penguin and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, in order to just keep this thing going when it has nothing to do with the actual art at all.

Yeah, I'm always trying to think of a way to make Social media fun, especially as an artist.Like, okay, do I try to think of it as a practice or make a project around it?Have you come up with any sort of games or whatever about just promoting your own works?

I can't say that I have.Yeah.

It's so tough.

Honestly, my best advice to anybody is schedule, send, post.There are tools out there that are like, okay, I have this one day where I can dedicate and make all the graphics and put all the things out there and try to do whatever on the story.But if you could just schedule that and just be.Put the phone down and just be out there and enjoy.

Keep it moving.

Yeah, that's my best advice I can give.

Yeah, that's the way.Because.Yeah.Oh, my gosh.I remember I went to this one event and they were talking about getting grants and stuff, and they asked the granters like, oh, how do you find, you know, people who to fund?And they did say, social media.They were like, that.That's just where they are.That's, like, their starting point.So when I'm always like, I'm gonna get off here.I'm like, I think about that conversation.Be like, I better not.

Yeah,.

But, you know, so you are a.Not just a filmmaker and a playwright, you're also a teaching artist.So does teaching make you a better storyteller, or does being an artist make you a better teacher?Ooh, you know, I was listening to the Diary of a CEO, which is such an interesting podcast, but I think his name's Steven Bartlett.He spoke about that.He's like, oh, yeah, you should teach.It just makes you better at your craft.So he's not necessarily speaking artist, but he's just saying how teaching makes you better at your craft.And I'm like, I'm gonna ask Radiation if they think that's how they think about that.

I think, if anything, teaching gives me the opportunity to dive into crafts that I'm not even always actively doing myself.Right.Like, some.Some things over with myself again.I've done teaching artistry with, you know, different organizations.The current one that I'm with, that I love is free spirit media.Free spirit community arts and media.Since, like, they're in this era of expanse.Right.And I love them so much because they're just like, ray, Sam, you can really teach whatever you want.You come up with the curriculum, come up with the whole thing.Carte blanche.What do you want to teach?And I'm like, oh, well, I am a big fan of standup comedy.So what would it be like to teach middle schoolers how to make their own sort of Def Jam comedy version of the show.Oh, my gosh.And let me tell you, they put me through the wringer.I bet you if you were a SpongeBob watcher at all.But it was that one episode of Band Geeks where.Okay, okay, yes.Where they were just putting Squidward through it.And at the very end, they were just like, you know what?No, we can rally around and do this thing.And they did it, and it blew my mind.I'm like, y' all were amazing.I remember seeing the days that you had stage fright.Right.Like, where you were even afraid to, like, tell your jokes in front of the class here, but look like the things that we were able to go through and reinforce.And I get to really, like, go through and, like, nerd out on these things.Currently, I'm teaching a class called Puppets for Positivity.

Okay.

And I. I grew up on Barney, Sesame street, et cetera.Like, truly.I mean, outside of my parents, of course.Right.But the standup values that were on tv, and I was just like, oh, there is a real power in puppetry, specifically.And again, they unlocked this code long ago that actually gets people to connect more with a topic or subject matter or anything like that.And I'm like, okay, well, even for my girlfriend's birthday, she also was a big Sesame street nerd and used to introduce herself and being like, hi, my name is so and so, and I'm on Sesame Street.And after they're like, wow, you're really on Sesame Street.And her parents would be like, no.So I went.And I'm like, I want to make a Sesame Street Muppet version of my girlfriend.And I was able to do it, and it was freaky how perfect it was.

You know what I mean?

And my first time going into puppet making, and I'm like, oh, I love that I actually get a chance to really dive deep on a subject and then be able to teach it at the same time, too.

Yeah.

So I think, if anything, teaching gives me an opportunity to be a more expansive artist.

Yeah.So wait, even just with the puppets, like, were they, like.Did you teach them to sew?Were they, like, sewing puppets and everything?

Not yet.

Okay.No, I just didn't know a fly.I was like, wow, you must learn really quickly.

Yeah, no, no, that's still something that I'm even building up to myself.Even the one that I made for my girlfriend was a no sew puppet.But again, I went down to.I Forget what the name of the store was, but it was like this big fabric store.

Mood Fabrics or Vogue Fabrics.

Something.Something of the sort.Right.But I'm like, I'm hauling couch cushion foam and getting stuff from the Chicago Tool Library just to be able to get everything.And I'm very particular.Days.No, not even days.Weeks.Actual weeks of work.And it's so hard to hide green fur in an apartment to keep it as a surprise.But you make these things happen when you're in love, you know?

Yeah, for sure.That is really, really, sweetie.Did she like the puppet?What'd she say?

She loved it.She.Her reaction to it was like, oh, my God, this is so fun.Oh, who made this?And then when I didn't say a thing, I just looked at some of the remnants of the green FL that was on the ground, and again, she's this beautiful, smiley, smiley person.Beautiful locks as well, you know, Imagine seeing, like a Muppet with locks.Yeah.You know what I mean?And she's just like, oh, wait, you made the.And then tears.And she cried, I cried.We crowed.You know, it was such a gift to be able to do that and be like.And then I remember bringing it over to Free Spirit, and I was just like, hey, yeah, like puppets for positivity.Like, can we do this?And they're like, yeah.Rae, Sam, you've demonstrated that you have the time, patience, and energy to do this.Go ahead and teach our kids this, too.And they love it.

Love it.Just a question about that company.When kids, they can just, like, sign up.Do the kids want to be filmmakers or this is just something for them to do for the summer, that their parents are like, here, you're going to learn to erase, Sam, to make a puppy.

It's an interesting mix of them, right?Because again, a lot of them are filmmakers that are doing it actively, and then some of them are aspiring filmmakers.

Oh, got it.Okay.

But some people are like, oh, I just like photography specifically, or I like dance, I like music.And something that's also really cool about Free Spirit is that it's a earn and learn program, too.So, like, again, when through middle school, high school, and then also with our Creative Pathways program, there is a stipend that is also given with the kids, too, because again, we also realize and recognize how much of a barrier it is for just one getting to a particular place, but also being able to keep the lights on, keep food, have some money to walk around with, and all that other good stuff.And they're doing it in a way, in an environment where they're learning from other peers at the same time with other great teaching artists as well, who are fantastic illustrators or designers or people who are really into crafting.They.The middle schoolers made paper this past summer.

Oh, my gosh.

You know what I mean?Like, they were really getting into their arts and crafts bag.And I thought it was beautiful to see.

Yeah, that's really beautiful to see.I love.I never thought about when you're paying kids to participate in stuff, I guess I was thinking of it, like, as a bribe.I guess I didn't think of it as, like, a way, like, to just support them to get to the program and, you know, transportation costs, meal costs, anything like that.Like, that's so smart.It wasn't until I got to college.It was a college.Or I also had.Did had like, a stint of college advising, but just, like, how much of a barrier transportation is like.To me, it's like, oh, the train station is like.You know, I lived in the suburbs at the time.The train station was close to my house.Walk to that boom at class, you know, but not everybody has that, you know, or, you know, or even just graduating high school, going to college, you know, and folks taking gap years.It's like, what you mean?You leaving the school?We in college.You can't leave.You know, like, we're supposed to do this.Then we'll have our careers.Duh.But, yeah, no, that's like, too much Saved by the Bell, I guess.You know, Saved by the Bell.You know, they went to school and they went to college.

Exactly.

Every last one of them, actually.I think.

Yeah.To be honest with you, I hadn't even watched Saved by the Bell.

Yeah.

No, but I could tell, for us, it was a different world.

Yes.

Okay.Okay.

I was.It's a yes.

And for me, it's a yes.

And it was Saved by the Bell, and I gotcha.A different world.

All right.

You know, shout out to Dennis Haskins passed away.The principal, Mr. Belding, I know you didn't watch, but just saying.It was like, oh, my gosh, Rip, you know you have the documentary feature that you're currently fundraising for, right?

Yes.

Is that the Harper?The vintage one?Okay.Okay, cool.I think because that small piece is called A Call with Melvin.I keep calling it to Melvin.

I know.I really do need to do something interchangeable.I'm like, oh, yeah, it'll be a cool little through line.And it's just like, okay, yeah, what.

Do you need to get that over the finish line,.

Really.Audience interest in the story.Like, that's my big thing right now.Because even with the current call to my call with Melvin, right.I was able to utilize things within my community with free spirit, with friends who are just willing to drive me around the south and west sides of Chicago, et cetera, in order to do it.And I'm also of the ethos of, like, if I don't have all of the money, like, I'm gonna do it broke.I'm gonna do this kind of thing here.I do like to pay people and pay people well, especially if these are people who I've come to know within the Chicago film scene that I'm like, I really respect their work.I really respect just, like, their practice, their eye.And I think that especially within, getting them fairly compensated for these things.Right.It's not just about, like, oh, yeah, like, the production, this and that, but, like, also the editor, also the other things that we're going to need to do to make this film accessible as well.And also, do you know, festival runs are, like, one thing.Sure, Right.And that's always like a sort of Las Vegas table that the filmmakers essentially accept as like, oh, you could win big or you can win nothing at all.Right.But the biggest thing is just cultivating that audience around it, because I want to actually get a chance to understand you and be able to even just with the way that I see the film.And of course, yes, it's about a man and his store and this and that and the journey that takes there.But also, it is a story about risks that we take in life.Right?

Yeah.

It's a story about going forth and following your passion when it calls you, when you're not expecting it.You know what I mean?There's so many things that are done and sacrificed and put aside for the idea of security.Right.And I'm not knocking anybody for having, like, oh, look, I have this situation, and it's good.It's cool.But there is also a thing, too, where it's like, is that a situation that's cool because you built that up and you're satisfied with where that is?Or if you're like, no, I can't move on to the next thing because I'm scared.I can't move on to the next thing because it would be really hard, or I don't think that people would support me or do anything like that.And I wanted to show people.No, you know what I mean?You can literally cross segregated neighborhood lines Set up an area that people might have looked down on and had this and that and do something that people didn't think that you would even be able to last a year in doing.Right.Never.Never mind surviving through Covid to do right.In order to make this kind of thing happen.Right.And I think that especially within telling black stories too, there is, of course, like, a tendency to tell our real experience.Right.And that also includes struggle.Right.But it's another thing to also do that in a way that says, like, no, there's hope in here.Right.Like, there's barriers that we're breaking.Sure.But also that's not as interested as to me as going forward, following your dreams, getting your passion, and also lifting other people up in the process.

Yeah, that's a really big thing.And you're right, because it's like he has this idea with this jacket that he likes and is really into this vintage and then sharing it.And, you know, there's like, that.Is it like Field of Dreams?If you build it, they will come.And there's definitely places where, like, meh, nobody's coming, but there's other opportunities where you're like, the folks really did come.Wow.Yeah.So that's like, so, so cool.You know, thinking back, just thinking back about this whole silly content creation and think about, like, video essays and, you know, your documentary work.Could you give us an assignment just like me and the viewer, you know, or the listener as we are just out and about, you know, making our own projects that maybe we can do, you know, make little documentaries in our life.Can you think of something that we could do?

Mm.Okay, I'll give you two.I'll put on my teacher hat and go.I'll give you two.One for extra credit.Okay.One.I would just say with whatever tools that you have, like, what is like the thing that you can nerd out and be the most passionate about and create something that's five minutes long?

Okay, Right.

Like before you have the idea for the big feature and the lights and the equipment and all that other kind of stuff.

Like.

No, no, no.Just with what you have five minutes doing the thing there.Beg, borrow, steal, like, whatever you gotta do.Right.I'm not sure if I could tell people to beg, borrow, or steal on the radio, but we'll be like, dang,.

Ray and Stephanie having us walking.

Exactly.However, make the thing and just know that there's going to be time to grow.But I will also challenge a person to say, like, go off of the beaten path of what you find interesting, right?Like, truly go around and explore your neighborhood and go into a place that you are like, oh, normally I'm not in here, but.And especially if the person is friendly and you strike up a conversation, you get to know the people who go there and the stories that are even there, too.Like, hey, even.And again, with permission, like, take out your phone, voice memos, whatever it is, and just record a conversation.

Oh, fun.

And just listen to that.You know what I mean?There's so many great things that can happen when you're just like, man, that was a great conversation.And every time I go into Harper Studio and Melvin's like, I gotta tell you something.Right?And after, I'm like, okay, let me bring out my voice memo here.Because I even go back and I listen to it, and I'm just like, wow, the wisdom that is here, the authentic experience that is here that most people would not know to ask a person that because they're thinking like, oh, yeah, that's just the person who owns the store.

Yeah.

They don't think, like, what happens when, you know, like, this person has to go to the grocery store or what their family life is looking like back home or anything like that.So pursue something you're passionate about and something that you have no knowledge but a lot of curiosity about.

Okay.I love those assignments.And I also love that he will tell you and he let you record them.

Yes.

He's like, yeah, sure, no problem.I also.It makes me wonder if he thinks, like, oh, you know what?Radiation might come in this week.Let me write down.Let me make a little list of things to tell.

I never let Melvin know when I'm coming.Like, it's always a surprise.He's like.I'm like, melvin, I have good news.And it's like, okay, great.Hold that thought.Let me help out this person first, and then we go about it from there.

Oh, my gosh.I love that.And I love it just as, like, a way just to build community, build neighborhood, ship, you know, big time.You know, as we, like, round out our conversation, like, is there anything that we should say that isn't been said?Do you want to say, you know.

Mm, that's a great question.I mean, I'm curious.What.What films, what TV shows are you watching right now?

Oh, yeah.You know what?I'm a Real Housewives person.Yeah.Thinking of, like, social impact documentary.

Yes.Yes.

I love.I love those ladies so much.And I feel like that's it.And it's so funny because I was just sitting at home thinking, like, stephanie, this is getting ridiculous.You need to, like, pick a TV show, you know, or, like, pick some shows and, like, get back into the mix.But, oh, my gosh, that's all I have.What about you?Let's turn it off on me.

Fair.I will say for myself, if I'm outside of documentary study mode, I'm usually watching anime.I'm officially caught up on One Piece, which is well over a thousand episodes at this point.Just truly good anime show.Yes.

Called One Piece.

It is, like, it's new.I mean, it started in 1999, and it's still running right now actively.And it's kind of near the end game right now.But I'm just.I just got so enamored into it.And after, I'm like, okay, it's a show about pirates and this and that.But then I'm like, no, but it's about friendship and it's about going against oppressive systems and all this stuff.And I'm like, I love this.But I will say in terms of a doc that I watched that I loved recently was Mr.Soul, talking about the show Soul that predates Soul Train, et cetera, and the host, Ellis Haizlip, and just the amazing, amazing stories that were captured on public television that, again, during a period of time where, like, the black image was always one that was pressed up against, like, a brick wall.Handcuffs on, right?Or being a mammy or doing sambo or any of these other kind of things, right?

Yeah.

But then Alice comes along and the producers come along, all these other people who are like, oh, we need to put poetry on this program.We need to put dance.We need to put things that are pushing conversations forward.We need to have radical thinkers on here.And after I'm like, how do they get away with this stuff?This is amazing to just see that this was just an accessible thing that we had here and we no longer do, you know.So it just brought me to this other era of an importance of filmmaking when we're again, like, thinking about how does this uplift our people, right?How does this expose them to different things that they might not have even thought possible because of who the rest of the media, who the rest of these institutions and all these other things that they're coming up against are telling them that they are.

You know, I really love public access media, you know, and I love, like, we're here at, like, can TV or whatever, you know, like, folks, you could learn how to use the equipment, check it out, make Your own shows and stuff.And, man, would you just get.You'd get so much from that.

Yeah.

And you'll meet people who's like, oh, yeah, I've had my show on Cannes TV for 20 years.And you're like, what?

Mm, yep.Straight up.Like, if not for my local access station, LTC datv, I would not have gotten as much exposure to the camera as much as I did since I was 13 years old.That was my first job at a local access television station and then just went off from there.

It's crazy.I love that.Yeah.So I feel like there's so many different resources that folks just need to take advantage of.

Yes.

And, you know, with the Chicago Marathon coming tomorrow, Are you a runner?Like, this is.It always just shocks me each time that folks are out here running like this.

Right.And, you know, the weather is fairly ideal for it.But, like, yeah, yeah, like, doing that, like, I'll clap along.I'll say, like, you know what?Y' all did a great job.

Yeah, me too.

But shout out to the runners out there.

Shout out to the runners, man.I think you were saying you were.You run.What were we saying before we started calling runners of Hustler University?Oh, yes, we were.

I know.I'm running around.I'm doing.Running to get groceries.Like, I'm running to.Yeah, it's a lot of stuff.

Oh, my gosh.I just want to shout out, you know, Lump and Family.I think it's Stephanie, Miriam, Paul, Dustin, Sergio, and William who will be running in the Chicago Marathon, which is so wild.Y' all are better than me.That's all I gotta say.

I hope y' all place.

Yeah, no, for sure, for sure.Oh, my gosh.Thank you so much.Just, like, even before we go, like.Okay, so it is.What was the name of this anime show that you called?

One Piece.

One Piece.All right.Any others that you would recommend?Okay, we have One Piece, Real Housewives, y'.All.

Yes.

Watch that.

This is so funny.I will also say watch Sherman's Showcase.

Okay.

Love that showdown.Like, it's one of my favorite comedy shows that came out.It was from the same creators who made Southside as well.

Oh, really?Okay.Sherman Showcase.

Sherman Showcase.Okay.

I did not know about this.What Streamer.

I believe it is on Hulu, but originally was made through ifc.

Okay.

Yes.

Awesome.So then we have.That's pretty rounded.That is a roundabout person going from One Piece to Real Housewives.Sherman Showcase.

Yup.

Oh, my gosh.I love another thing.I had Thought about was, I love that you pay people for your projects.Thank you for doing that.Because it also made me think about the free spirit media.I said it right?Correct.Yeah.About how they pay us.Like, dang, they're paying us but Raviation's not paying us.It's just like you got to keep it.

Yes.

Keep it going.And that's just so nice.It's.Yeah.I find that, yeah, favors are always there and.But yeah, it's been.I've gotten to the level where I'm like, oh, I gotta pay them.

Yeah.

You know when I hear people are like leaving with their like kids or whatever at home and they're coming here to do this for me, brought their equipment, I'm like, oh yeah, I gotta give you something.

Something like, like at the very least, feed your people.

Feed.Yes.

You know, like that.That's super, super important.And again, it's a.Especially because again I came to the city and I was like, I'm going to quit my corporate job and I'm gonna freelance and do all this stuff.But then when seeing all of those opportunities fall through in the first month after I left my job, I was just like, oh, this stuff.Money will come, money will go.But also just the recognition that it cost somebody down the line somewhere.And outside of money, what are some of the other things that I could do to appreciate you too?I'll do that too.But also when I'm building up a production team, am I doing it in a way that is balanced and respectful of just having a non male dominated film set for sure.Is this something that the people who are a little bit more established in their careers are also looking at the people who are coming up as opportunities to say, yeah, I wanna teach you, I wanna learn, I wanna learn from you.I wanna have all these other kind of things here too.Cause what use is it to be an old guard that's not crossing and passing the flame, period?

Rayviation.Thank you so much for more information.Where can we get your details?

Sure.I would say Instagram would be the fastest way to find me at Raviation Rocks.I also will have a website as well.You could look up like raviationwebflow IO.

Okay.

So that's also where you can find my good portfolio stuff.And also if you look up rayviation on YouTube as well, that's why I have some of the other films as well.And if you're interested in seeing some of my other stuff, that's where I got them.

I would love it.Thank you guys so much for listening to us today.And again if you are running tomorrow, good luck, stay hydrated and congratulations ahead of time.Thank you.And yeah, it is 3 o' clock and have a great day.Chicago, do you want to say bye to Chicago?

Bye, Chicago.I love you.Mwah.Stephanie, it was great.

It really was.Thank you so much.This has been another episode of noseyAF where we have conversations about art, activism and social change.I'm your host Stephanie Graham.I hope you took something away from today.Maybe an idea, a feeling, something to sit with or just a good time.And honestly, I'm always here for a good time.Quick thank yous go out to Queen Lex and Freddie Bamfam for the nosy AF theme music and Emma McGolrick for cover art and branding.And that's the show friends.Until next time, stay curious and take care by.