The Power of Intentional Community Building with Lindsay Lerner

Hey, friend.

Welcome or welcome back to Nosy AF conversations about art, activism and social change.

I'm your host and friend, Stephanie Graham, and today on Nosy af, I'm chatting with Lindsay Lerner.

Lindsay is a community builder, photographer, creative strategist, and honestly, probably one of the most intentional people you'll ever meet.

Lindsay is the founder of Field Notes from the Work in the Wild, which is a storytelling project that captures people in those in between moments.

And we all know them, right?

Like before the big scene, before the outcome, the quiet rituals and truths that we don't always talk about.

Lindsay and I, we get into everything from why Lindsay says she's allergic to the status quo, which is anybody else.

I mean, for real.

And then also we talk about how capitalism shapes the way we value each other and to what it really means to build community that matters.

And trust me, this conversation, it sort of goes everywhere in the best way.

So let's get into some theme music and then we will get to chatting with our new friend, Lindsay.

Welcome to Nosy af.

Gotta get up, get up to the whole world.

You a winner, winner, vision of a star with a mission in the cause what you doing, how you doing, what you're doing and who you are Flex yourself and press yourself Check yourself, don't wreck yourself if you know me then you know that I be knowing what's up.

Hey, Stephanie Graham is nosy as.

Lindsay.

Welcome to Nosy af.

Thank you for having me.

I am so happy that you are here.

You are so fun and so joyful.

You know, one of the things I really want to get into with is you said that you're allergic to the status quo.

And I'm wondering what's.

Yes.

What's something that you've realized recently that you were tolerating that had to go.

You know, like we're all in an assessment time.

Let's just see.

Like this is what Lindsay said has to go.

Yeah.

This might be what I need to have go.

Yeah, yeah.

I think the biggest thing, especially the last couple of months, has just been recognizing there you do have a sense of power and agency.

If you want to take the accountability for the work that you're doing day to day.

And we could be talking about the internal work, the work work, capitalism work, what you get paid.

Like all of that I think is what's been swimming in my head.

And I think for a long time I just spent.

Even though I've mostly only worked for myself, there's been so many times where I've just felt that Robin Hood energy of like, okay, I have my project and I'm most stoked on my project.

And I'm gonna make this thing work and bring it to fruition and bring it to life.

But also, rent is real.

Having a mortgage is real.

Having a kid, it's real.

Like, all of that.

And so then constantly just going and like, doing these moonlighting gigs essentially, and then being like, okay, cool, like, I got enough Runway so I can do X, Y or Z.

And lately just really drawing that line in the sand and being like, nope, this is the type of work that I want to do.

These are the type of people that I would like to work with.

And after having far too many shit experiences.

Yeah.

Over the last, you know, 15 plus years, now there's.

There's an understanding of.

To your point, like, you do not have to tolerate most.

Most things.

Yeah.

Yeah.

That's so real.

You know, it's funny you say 15 years.

Sometimes people are like, oh, it'll take three to five years.

And I'm like, that's not true.

No, no, no, no, no.

And it's.

I mean, it's just different.

Different levels of.

Not even levels.

I don't think it's.

It's.

It's ladder.

Ladder esque.

Like the corporate.

Corporate realm.

But I just think that it's more about the work that you're doing on yourself.

And I would argue the person being way more comfortable and confident with myself and being like, oh, no.

Yeah, no, just no.

And I catch myself now.

I'm like, wow.

You know, Lindsay, five years ago, totally would have just sucked it up and kept it moving and did the thing.

And now, like, I'm in the middle of a contract right now.

And it's.

It's supposed to last probably through the end of the year if I played my cards right.

And already I'm like, my entire body is like, no, you need to.

Oh, my God, you need to stop doing this.

And my friend, yeah, my best friend, she's.

She's a good one.

Shout out to Joanne.

You gotta.

She really called me in and she was like, what have we learned?

And I'm like, we need to listen.

We need to listen.

And she's like, yes.

And we're like 30 days in so we can make a faster decision instead of waiting 30 months.

Like, you're right.

You're right.

That kind of decision gets hard, though.

When you need money, dude.

When there's bills.

That's my biggest existential crisis on a daily basis is like, why is it that we've created the structures that we've created.

And how is that?

We've decided that this is how we're going to value each other and as people and worthiness and work.

Like, all of that is so, so convoluted to me.

It's overwhelming.

And you're right.

It's like, yeah, we're all here together.

Let's all treat each other fairly and the same.

Right.

Because everybody's doing their part and it all matters.

Like, it all needs to be connected to each other.

Exactly.

But I think that's the part where that a lot of folks are out of touch with, of how this action impacts the next one.

Impacts the next one.

And there's.

There's nobody connecting those dots.

Although that's what keeps me up at night.

Me too.

I, like, feel like we should have, like, a Styrofoam cup with a telephone line on it so you can, like, talk.

Like, are you up?

Yes.

The answer is yes.

Oh, it's us.

Because it's all, like, capitalism's fault.

Right.

Sometimes I'm like, did capitalism do anything good?

Because everybody always blames everything on capitalism.

Yeah.

I mean, it's interesting.

Cause I was having this conversation yesterday, actually, with someone, and my default, I kept resorting back to we.

And how is this going to impact the collective?

And this woman was pushing back on me pretty hard.

She was like, well, that's the problem.

You're just afraid to step into your independence and your identity, and you're this.

And I was like, I really.

I'm like, I think this is the problem.

I think.

I think you named it of like, we need less.

I. I am very confident in my own abilities.

I can get shit done.

I'm not.

I'm not sweating that.

What bothers me is this.

This is what bothers me.

Yeah.

It's like, it can't just always be like, me.

For example, my neighbor was just upset because he was talking about he was going to the gym.

And they approached him about personal training.

Sure.

You know, and so they were like, oh, yeah, you know, it's like $3,500.

Isn't that.

He's like, okay.

I'm not like, no, thank you.

I'm fine with just doing what I'm doing, you know?

And then the trainer said to him, like, well, you just don't want to invest in yourself.

And he's like, no, I don't have the money to do, like.

No, I'm just.

I don't.

I don't have the money.

I don't see this as valuable enough totally to, like, pay for this.

What I'm doing is fine.

You approached me, but it doesn't mean that I don't feel valuable.

He's like, oh, my gosh, it was so funny at the mailbox.

He's like, can you believe he said that to me?

I'm not valuable.

I'm very valuable.

I'm going to work, you know?

And he's like, totally.

I love him.

He's always, like, going on a rant about something with me.

And so I'm just like, yeah, that was so rude.

It is.

It is rude.

It is rude.

I agree with that.

And I think there's so much nuance to it too, because I do.

On one hand, this is something I've been working on for a long time, and I, I can't always make it make sense in my brain.

My wife is very good at it.

And it's, it's holding two things to be true at the same time.

And as a very, very literal person, I'm like, how do you do this?

And I think that's, that's the nuance.

I'm like, on one hand, I do 100 full body.

Yes.

Believe that the work that you do on yourself and the way that you show up in the world and the energy that you bring is what's going to make a situation, an interaction, a relationship that much better.

Because if you feel grounded and calm and solid, then that's the place that you're going to move from.

And that more often than not, is a great place to be.

And then simultaneously, if, like, you can't.

I think a lot of instances in which I've seen that it comes across in this very, to your point, capitalistic, very individual based.

Come hell or high water, I'm just gonna do what's best for me and no one else matters.

And I'm like, well, that.

That doesn't make sense either.

Yeah, that's not helpful either.

That's not helpful either.

Well, you have this project, field notes.

Can you tell us about it?

Cause I love your black and white photography work, by the way.

35 millimeter work that you do.

Thank you.

But I know your field.

It is photography, but it's writing and documenting, and I was hoping you could.

Share it with us.

Yeah, I would love to.

I would love to.

Yeah.

Field notes.

Field notes from the Work in the Wild is a storytelling project that captures people in the moments before they're seen.

And it's all about the work before the outcome.

So more of that messy middle, the quiet rituals and the truths that people are still learning to say out loud.

And that's like, I mean, that's the best part.

That's the point of the podcast now.

Yeah.

Right.

And the.

Each, each story that I publish combines a portrait, a one liner that I like to think of as like their essence in a way, and a short audio reflection that helps people really feel deeply seen and understood.

And the intention with that audio is as much as the story is about that person.

I also braid together, like their story, things that I've learned along the way, other stories that I may have heard, a potential, whether it's like a spiritual teaching or an insight or sometimes I go kind of religious, but religious in like very broad terms.

Braid that all together so that anyone who's listening can really find something that resonates with them.

Yeah.

Because what I really enjoy about it, that I'm not really into like the tech world, you know.

So I feel like through your field notes project, I know it has a longer title, but I feel like I get to learn about that culture because I'm never around it.

But I feel like people around me always have an idea for an app.

They're like, oh, that should be an app.

That should be an app, you know?

Yeah.

And that's what's been so cool.

Is like my, my vision for this project was to be able to.

Because I.

For the longest time.

And as, as corny as this sounds, I'm going to say it anyway.

I've always believed that diversity is what drives innovation.

And I think innovation has been this buzz, big, big ass buzzword for a long time.

To your point, it's in tech, it's in startups, it's in this, like, whatever.

At the end of the day, like you are not going to get anything that is actually innovative if you keep doing the same shit, different day.

And it comes from different people, different perspectives, ages, races, cultures, ethnicities, gender, sexual orientations, you name it.

And I, because I've always been more of a chameleon since I was a little kid, all the way through high school, like I never had a group of friends.

It was like, I'm going to sit at this lunch table and that lunch table and this lunch table and whatnot.

And I think a lot of times that felt isolating.

But now, especially through this project, it's been so cool.

I'm like, some days I go into a music studio and some days I'm in some corner office and some days I'm running around Brooklyn Chasing people on city bikes.

It's like, you never know.

Or an artist studios.

Like, I was with this oil painter a couple weeks ago and I was like, wait, you.

How did you.

That's how you do that.

Like, I had no idea.

I was with a stylist last.

Was it last week?

And just the way that she spoke about, like, clothing and what it does for her and why, I was like, wow, like, that is far out.

Tell me everything.

Yes.

I love that.

I love that.

I feel like such relationship with that, with what I'm doing here, because I feel like it's always so varied.

Different creatives, different perspectives.

Exactly.

And I'm like that too.

Like, I grew up the same way, having different friends from, like all the groups.

I'm like, at the goth kid party on Saturday with like the popular girls, with the, like, girls that's being picked on.

Like, I like to meet everybody, you know, And I feel like as an adult, that sort of translates to, like, now, you know, everybody too.

And you can always like, put people together to build your network up, but it can be isolating.

I do get that.

Yeah, there's a.

There's a fine.

A fine line.

I would love.

At some point I want to do some sort of in person installation of some sort, which is.

I've never done anything like that.

But since a lot of these folks that I've been photographing recently are all New York based, I feel like that would be really cool to like, do some sort of pop up and have all these people in the same room.

And that's something like when I'm at that level of having just wild fuck you money, that is.

I just want to send all these people that I know plane tickets.

Just everyone that I used to have on, like my podcast, all these different projects and just have them in the same room.

I'm like, what would happen?

Yes, it would be.

So when they're all together.

Yes.

Yeah.

For my birthday a couple years ago, I.

This was like, post pandemic.

I was just missing everyone and I was like, I'm gonna use my birthday as an excuse.

And I got my wife, a couple of like my very dear friends, my parents, and a couple of their friends I'm very close with.

And I was like, we're going to Costa Rica.

And they're like, what?

I was like, it's my birthday, please.

And they're like, like, okay.

And they're definitely like.

They're not like adventure Costa Rica people necessarily, but I was like, get in the van especially.

I went into, like, tour manager mode.

I was like, just.

Just, please just come with me.

And so they did, and it was amazing because it was like, all these people that I. I love so much and so deeply, and they all bring out different sides of me.

What I did not clock was that they all bring out different sides of me and how wildly exhausting that was.

Yeah.

And it was like, my mom's calling me in the living room, and my friend wants to go, you know, down to the beach, and my wife wants something else that I was like, oh, my gosh, this was a terrible idea.

You're like, do y' all see the itinerary I put together?

Follow that, please.

Exactly.

That's why I made it.

Damn it.

Oh, my gosh.

But, yes, that.

That.

Okay, so one thing I want to bring up.

So, like, since you have, like, all these, like, different friends and stuff like that, as we're talking, you talk about, like, community.

I know that's really big.

Also another big word.

Everybody's all about community these days.

Ooh, innovative communities, right?

Yes.

That's all you need, is to be innovative and have a community.

You'll have a multi gazillion dollar company.

You will exit.

You'll be set for life.

Yes, yes.

So, yeah, so you talk about community.

That actually matters.

And so I'm curious, like, what does that look like in practice when nobody's watching?

Right.

But that's it.

It is a practice.

And I think that's.

That's the problem is so many, especially brands these days.

Everything is a community.

And I'm like, there is a very big difference.

I would argue between a community and an audience.

And there's also a difference between a community and fans, especially having a music background.

That's something that I've seen more often than not for better or worse, is artists misconstruing their fan base as their community.

And I'm like, yeah, could you break.

Down, like, the difference?

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

I think how I see it is that when you have an audience that's one to many, so if insert.

Whatever brand you're a fan of sells a thing to you, great.

You're in their audience.

That's cool.

That doesn't.

You're not, like, going to bat for this brand.

You don't.

It doesn't matter.

You just bought their shit and you're happy with their product and you keep it moving.

Maybe you get an email from them.

That's fine.

Yeah.

Then I think the next layer of that is having fans, and those are people who Tell people whether it's about a musician or a product or a service or what have you, those are people who do actually care.

But still that relationship, I would argue is still one way.

And most more importantly, the nuance is that there might be people that are fans, especially in music.

Like I worked in hip hop and K pop.

Like fan bases.

Hardcore fan bases.

Yeah.

And I would argue the difference between just having an audience and then the next level of having a fan would be fans typically could talk to each other about that connection point of that artist, for example, or even of that brand.

So that's like audience, then fan and then community is when there's actual relationship and all of the dots start to connect and there's more meaning and there's.

There's a two way conversation rather than one way.

Those are, that's how I conceptualize it.

I see.

So like if I had a listener email me and we go back and forth, would that person be my community?

If you want to structure it in that way, that might be a fan still.

Because it's more transactional.

It's more like what is it that you have in common?

Is there some.

It's like I think Seth Godin is the one who says it.

It's like people like us do things like this.

And so that's more from marketing lens, given the work that he's done.

But I think that that's.

There needs to be a relation, like an actual relationship that is a two way street, not just one way.

Okay, interesting.

Cool.

Yeah, it's like I keep, I'm thinking of Beyonce.

Like Beyonce's beehive.

Those would be her.

Those are fans.

Those are fans.

They're not her community.

Right.

Like so many people, so many, especially artists, they're all, they're on discord, they're on whatever tools that they're on.

And yeah, and maybe, maybe not Beyonce, but I know some musicians who are active on their discord and they are chatting with people and like that makes fans feel great.

Of course you're not hanging out with them.

You are not going to go and grab a coffee or a meal or what have you.

You know what I mean?

Like, I think that's the, the, the nuance.

And I spent the last two, a little over two years working with the generalist world community and that was very much like we grew that community to almost 700 people.

But we knew like, and we're in relationship with a lot of these people.

But I think that's the part of the frustration and part of the struggle right now is the commodification of community and it's community as a service.

So there's blurred lines.

It's like I loved and cared about all of those people.

Was it because I was getting paid to do so?

Was it because they were paying me?

Was it because I actually cared?

Like there's so much, there's so much nuance to it.

And I think just biologically, I think, I think the number, if I remember correctly is like as humans we're only going to remember like 1500 names.

Like that's it.

Okay, that makes sense.

And then your brain taps out and relationally you're built, I mean back, you know, thousands, hundreds of thousands of years ago, it's like you had 150 relationships and that was how you move through the world more from an anthropological standpoint.

And I think like that you gotta think about that too.

Yeah.

It's like so Beyonce's beehive probably millions and millions and millions of people.

I know, right?

She was just somebody who.

I'm like, okay, everybody would know who that is because.

Yeah.

So I wanna go back for the listener.

Seth Godin is like, just to tell you guys is like this marketer guy.

Yeah.

That a lot of marketers, folks who might work for brands, startups, maybe product based businesses, not necessarily like artists, activists might not turn to Seth Godin.

Totally.

But Seth Godin is somebody who people look to as a person of like how do, how should we see others?

How should we market to others?

How should we think about marketing?

For sure.

Yeah, yeah.

Seth, Seth's quote is people like us do things like this and that's very, very.

I think it taps into people's like real primal sense of being and it's very cliquey and it's very like you can't sit with those vibes.

Yes.

And that's the thing.

And you see that.

I mean especially being in New York City, it's everything is from run clubs to coffee clubs to startups to tech bro this to founders that, to artists to photographers, what have you.

It's very much a.

We do it this way and this is why you're going to be accepted here.

Yeah, I love that.

The nuance.

Yeah, I love that.

So like who are your people?

And like where did you find your people?

I think that's.

Man, that's such a nuanced question or something that I grapple with is like I don't.

There are one to one relationships that I, that feed me and keep me, keep me going and there is not and has not been one group ever where I've really been able to exhale.

Yeah.

And I think I've been searching for that.

And I think with field notes, this is really the first time where I'm like, no, this, this I like, because I'm not.

I don't want to hang out with just like photographers or people who identify deeply as like photographers or people who identify deeply as storytellers or founders or artists.

To me, it's that combination of the different things that really makes a difference.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

It's just like being with everybody.

But, like, do you go out a lot or do you.

Is it like online and then you try to get like, zoom calls?

A lot of my.

A lot of the people that I've worked with, especially over the last couple of years, being in the community space that I've connected with, folks, especially the Generalist World team, they're international, so they're.

Can you explain the Generalist world just for folks who might not know.

Totally.

It's a really cool project, guys.

Yeah.

Generalist World is a community for folks that have had nonlinear careers.

So other fellow squiggly, Squiggly path folks, whether you've, you know, switched industries or you've job hopped and where you're looking at your career less like a ladder and more like a flywheel.

So it's like, how is this project that I'm working on potentially going to.

And it's not always intentional, but having the vision of how could this then open a door for that and really following more of your intuition and working with things that are in alignment rather than simply chasing a paycheck for most, most folks who are in the community.

Yeah.

And I mention it because I know, like, artists, you know, might always like, think of, oh, what's something else I can do?

Or.

Yeah.

Even for myself, with the film world acting as crazy as it is, I'm like, oh my gosh, do I need to pivot out of this?

And like, I checked out Generalist World just to sort of see like, what else could it be if it is to be something, you know?

Totally.

Totally.

And I think that's the thing just in terms of like, work, that's another, another existential spiral.

Totally.

But it's been really cool with, with the Generalist World community to be able to see how many different career paths are.

Are out there.

And there's another community as well, the Outlier project that's full of folks who, who do really just incredible work.

Everything from Professional football players, through CEOs, through artists, photographers, like, you name it, they're in there.

And I think it's just important to be able to have more potential examples and, or inspiration for those moments when you're feeling low, when you're feeling down, when you're looking around being like, am I, am I, am I actually losing it?

Is this, is this a me problem?

Yeah.

But yeah, I mean, through, through all of that, I met so many people everywhere.

And so most of my close, close friends are 6, 8, 18 hour time zones away.

Unfortunately.

That's tough.

18 hours?

Yeah.

Like, oh my goodness.

I think I struggle with like my friends on like Pacific timeline.

I'm like, oh my gosh.

No, totally, totally.

And so it just makes the time, the physical time that we get together even more important.

Like, one of my dearest friends, Nikita, was here visiting from London a couple of weeks ago.

And it just felt like, it felt so nice to be with someone who knows and understands me so well and share physical space.

It was like, like, I can be.

Yeah, yeah, exactly, exactly.

You've like been all over and you've even like lived.

You've like done the whole van life thing.

Yeah.

And I think that was the other thing too is like when I.

Cause I was a tour manager for more than 10 years and if the right act came along, I probably could be convinced to do it again.

But I think because of that, like, I did that for 10 years and so I was doing laps around the States and then every once in a while could go to Europe or the uk and so I got to meet people from everywhere.

So when I did have my van, it was very funny.

I felt like I did van life wrong in some ways because most people were like, out in the woods and I was like parked in front of my friend's house in Chicago, parked on the street, like, here we are.

Well, that's nice to know that van life can be however you want it.

Right?

Because when people mention that to me and you see people on Instagram, they're like in the middle of a desert somewhere and I'm like, does somebody know where you are?

Yeah, I mean, I did do some of that, but a lot of it was.

It was about the people and so being able.

And that's what honestly gave me the confidence to do it as well.

Like, I was by myself.

So a lot of people looked at me, you know, I.

There was some, some words exchanged, some looks exchanged.

They're like.

And I'm like, in my head, my justification at the time was like the worst case scenario is that no matter, almost any state across the entire United States, I know somebody who would drive very quickly and be to me within an hour.

That's nice.

You know, like that's not too bad.

No, that's a great network.

So I.

That's a great friend.

Yeah.

That's what made me, that's what made me feel good.

And that's what you really, you develop.

And I know if I remember correctly, you've obviously worked in service based industries throughout your career and like that's what develops in, in the touring production realm is like people who will go to bat for you.

It's like seeing some shit together.

What would you think would be like a problem you solved when you were on the road that made you feel like a total badass?

Well, a couple come to mind.

But the first, the reason why I loved touring for so long, which I think by the, by the end, the last time I was on the road was in 2023.

And I think perhaps like that's when therapy really started to kick in and be like, maybe we liked touring because we just got to control everything.

Maybe I'm like, I think, I think we nailed that one.

But the first tour that I did was actually Warped Tour.

I don't know if you ever went to Warped Tour.

No.

Who was on Warped Tour?

Warped Tour ran, excuse me, for 25 years.

And it started out as a punk rock, very indie scene.

It was sponsored by vans.

It was Vans Warp Tour.

Oh, cool.

Yeah, no, I definitely didn't go in that.

And so for the first probably 10, 15 years it was strictly like punk and hardcore and metal and ah, like a lot.

Just not my scene either.

And then they attempted and started to diversify and the.

I was on the road with two hip hop acts that it was, it was very funny because you would have like screaming like emo bands and then you would have just the opposite.

Yeah.

Which is a very.

Or something.

Right.

It was a very funny experience.

But I, I was on that tour just as an extra set of hands.

I was working with this artist.

He happened, he was like, hey, I need help finding a tour bus.

And this was one of my first gigs in music.

And I was like, yeah, I can, I can do that.

I don't.

What, I don't know how the hell to find a tour bus.

I'm on Google tour bus.

Like, what?

Like where do you find this shit?

Then I'm all of a sudden in the depths of Facebook groups of, of bus drivers, which are mostly, admittedly, very kind of creepy old men.

And I'm like, this is not.

This is not good.

I'm on the phone with these people because to be a bus driver, you essentially have to be like a complete night owl.

You sleep all day, you drive all night.

Like, that's your life.

That's what you do.

So it takes a certain type of person to be able to.

To do that.

Yeah.

Anyway, that's for sure.

That's.

We found.

We found the bus, we found the driver, and this artist I was with was like, oh, well, we have an extra bunk.

Like, why don't you just come?

It'd be a lot easier to do our work together.

And I was like, 19, 20.

I was like, yeah, okay.

Like, my.

My fingers typed yes.

Before I could even, like, process it.

I was like, wow, I'm going.

And.

Yeah, and so that was the first.

First tour that I did.

And then when we were on the road, the tour manager that we had got themselves fired for a plethora of reasons.

And they were like, well, you're here, you're organized.

And I was like, okay, yeah, so it is me.

There was one other woman on the road and 10 grown men, and I'm the tour manager now and you're the boss.

Yep.

Okay.

And so by the.

That was almost three months.

That was.

That was like 20,000 miles.

It was a unhinged tour.

And after that, I was like, oh, if I can do that.

Yeah, absolutely.

I'm so good.

I'm so good.

I love it.

I love it.

And they listened, I bet, and just like, you know the plan, and we're going to check in with you.

We're going to go where you tell us to be.

Exactly.

I love that.

Okay.

100%.

That's really, really good.

That's really good.

I could see why you could be like.

It's like, okay, glad that was a moment.

But if somebody was to call, you might be like, okay, who's it for?

Yeah, well, that was the thing.

You get to have, like, more and more discernment as you go.

Because in the beginning, I just said yes.

And then all of a sudden, it's like me driving a van for 12 hours to get to the show.

Oh, my gosh.

You know, you, like, you gotta make it happen versus other tours.

You know, as you.

As you progress in the industry, you get to be picky a little bit and you get to have a tour bus, you get to have a driver, you get to have an assistant.

That was one of my favorites, having an assistant meant I could go to sleep.

And then they got to make sure everyone was on the bus at 3am I was like, yup.

And they were probably like, I'm not.

Built for the music industry.

I got this.

Exactly.

I got this.

Oh, he was thrilled.

I still.

He actually texted me yesterday.

He was amazing.

I love that.

Thanks for sharing that.

That's really, really fun.

Oh, my gosh.

So wait.

Okay, so back to field notes from the Work in the Wild.

Yeah.

Yeah.

You said, like, one of the things that you get to do is, like, see people in their element.

And I'm just curious, like, do you have any advice for, like, when you might know you've stepped into your element?

You know, like, for when someone.

Or like, maybe even when you see the person where you're like, oh, yeah, they're like, this is them.

They're.

They're in.

They're doing their thing, you know?

Totally, totally.

It's when you forget that anyone else is there and it happens.

Like, I.

The click moment.

And maybe this is my bias, but I've seen the click moment happen sooner for the artists that I've gotten to share space with.

Like, one of my buddies is a music producer, and, like, watching him, just, like, there's a.

There's a very distinct before and after of, like, you're chatting with me and you are in another realm, and that's awesome.

And so being able to witness that, I think is really, really powerful.

And it's also too.

I think it's.

It's really funny because the way that I do it is we'll sit down for anywhere between an hour, hour and a half, and we'll do an interview.

And as we're chatting, I'm typically taking photos, which for the first, like, 15, 20 minutes, makes people very uncomfortable, I.

Would think so every time, because they're.

Yapping, they're chatting, and then they're like, but should I smile?

Should I look at you?

Should I?

And then after we do it, they forget that I'm there and that, like, nine times out of 10 has been where some of the best photos have come from.

Because I am very intentional about the questions that I ask and what we're talking about and why we're talking about and the way that we're moving through space together.

And that's where I think that one of the unlocks is because they get so excited and so lost.

Like, they.

They could talk to a wall.

I don't even need to be there.

They're just so stoked on the thing that they're talking about.

And I'm like, yeah, like, keep it coming.

Keep it coming.

And it's always.

It's not even typically, like, I know it's going to go a different direction.

They come in, they're like, I'm going to talk about my company.

And I'm like, this has nothing to do with your company.

And then all of a sudden, they're like, the one guy I was with this week, he was.

He really wanted to make it about his company.

And so he's bringing it back to the company.

Bring it back to the company.

And then all of a sudden, we started talking about running and racing and triathlons over to, like, his real.

Why?

And his entire demeanor just shifted.

And I was like, cool.

Like, tell me more about that.

Yeah.

And then once he started talking about that, then it made so much more sense as to why he likes to do the things that he does.

I love that.

And it feels like almost like a reality show.

Like, they get to have this person documenting them for the day.

And then, like reality show stars, they'll say, like, after a while, you forget that those producers and camera people are there.

Totally, totally.

And it's.

It's fun because it's so much more.

It's an experience.

And that's what I want people to have.

And I want them to exhale as well.

And that's something that I do.

And I don't know if you do this with folks in portraits as well.

Cause I think there's a certain visual they have in mind of, like, this is the headshot that I want, and this is how I want to look, and this is how I want to be perceived.

And.

And I'm like, we don't need that.

And so we do.

Like, the more and more that I've gotten comfortable with breathing and slowing down and holding eye contact and, like, really being in it, I'm like, like, on Tuesday, there's one woman, she was.

She was very stressed, and she was like, you're very.

We were.

We were in very close proximity, but I had a 35 millimeter on.

So, like, it.

It wasn't.

But she thought that I was, like, basically taking photos up her nose.

And I was like, that's not.

Don't worry.

Put my camera down.

And I, like, took her hands, and I was like, we're gonna take a deep breath.

And she was like, we're what?

And I was like, we're gonna do this.

And it took, like, five deep breaths.

But eventually she was like, okay.

Okay, yeah, yeah, yeah.

And I was like, great, you're here now.

Now we can take a photo of you, not whoever you thought that was.

And did she.

Did she feel better?

Yeah, oh, definitely.

Definitely.

And she was like, oh, those.

You know, you captured the magic.

The photo came out great.

I was like, there is a method.

There is a method to the madness.

I haven't always been able to articulate it, but there is.

And that even brings me to, like, you host these scheming sessions with folks, which.

I love that name.

That is such a good name.

It's like, oh, yeah, I want to scheme.

I want to scheme.

Yeah.

I love scheming sessions.

Yeah.

And so it makes me think that, like, you probably are with folks who.

And even yourself has been, like, in, like, I want to say reinvention, but maybe not necessarily reinvention, just like a different.

Just riding the wave, you know?

And I'm just curious, like, what does stability look like with that?

Like, while you're.

Cause, like, even when people are trying to do more is the.

Like, do you.

Do you have an answer for that?

Do you know?

Yeah.

Or do you talk to your clients about that?

Yeah, we spend a lot of time.

We spend a lot of time talking about that.

And something that became more and more popular over the last couple of.

Couple of years has been this idea of a portfolio career.

And so that's something that's like.

And it's funny because it's just a.

It's a vernacular change.

It has nothing to do with the actual shit that you do.

And it, like, I just think it's amusing because it's like, you could be a freelancer.

You could be a solopreneur.

You could be a portfolio careerist.

You could be an octopus person.

You could be a generalist.

You could, like a multi hyphenate.

A multi snobby name.

I'm like, snobby name to say, right.

I have a portfolio career.

Like, what?

Right.

Well, it's stupid.

It cracks me up.

Yeah.

And I've got.

I've got good pals that I think are amazing humans that I have worked with over the last couple of years who have made hundreds of thousands of dollars off of portfolio career coaching.

And to your point, it's helping people navigate the instability and the ups and the downs.

And that's where I'd argue.

I'm like, most of that comes from more of that inner work.

And that, to me, is what field notes is about.

Like, that's so cool that you can be a flashy Musician and a music producer and an oil painter and a tech founder.

But what is like who is that person?

Who did you need to become to be able to do that and to do it in a way where you're not completely neurotic and losing it?

Yeah.

And what I sort of like too with that whole like portfolio career thing is that it's sort of dispelling this idea that you know, if, for example, if you're not an artist full time.

Yeah.

You're a failure.

Like that's not true.

Like, because you'll see people that they might be an artist and then they might go in Uber or they might go and work at the accounting firm or at the dance studio, like anything hundred percent.

And I think that's always, for me, I've always been in between worlds and at that intersection of art and business.

And I would argue in a lot of ways art is a business and business is an art.

When executed really well and when you have a mastery of it, I think that it can be done really, really beautifully.

I think the issue is there's so much that gets caught, I would argue in the identity of it.

And to your point, it's like, well, if I'm an artist then I cannot drive for Uber and I can't be an accountant and I can't.

And I can't.

And I can't and I can't.

And it's like you, you have permission to be more than one thing.

And I think portfolio career has become a safe way for people who have been in corporate to start to slowly like that.

Like Homer Simpson, like gif.

Where he like backs into the bushes.

Yes.

Like that's, that's what it feels like.

They're like, oh, so I don't, I don't need to be in this like stuffy office every day from 9 to 5.

I can do these other things.

And I think that's what's been really interesting to see.

And I like, I like you have been doing freelancing, whatever the hell you want to call it for a long time and have been getting side eye for a long time and now we've.

Been a portfolio career.

What are you talking about?

I'm like, yeah, this is what we've been doing.

And so it's nice.

And I like the fact that I can say that I'm working on projects X, Y and Z and not deal with bullshit anymore.

That's lovely.

Yeah.

But like I, I really love scheming session though, because I feel like it just like I, I Always, like, gravitate towards, like, gangsters and like, underground stuff anyway.

So I feel like, let's just sort of get a plan.

And, you know, there's that whole, like, phrase to like, moving in silence.

You know, it's like, don't tell people your plan.

Like, there's that whole crew that likes to, like, build it out loud.

You know, other people are like, no, no, no, keep it to yourself.

Keep it to the chest.

And so that's what I sort of like about that is like, somebody can connect with you and be like, on the underground, like figuring out what's next, you know?

Yeah.

And I think that's the scheming sessions.

I offered those at the beginning of the year.

It was like, hey, if you want to work with me for a year, pay me three grand.

You can call me as many times as you want.

Let's see what happens.

And there was only a handful of people that took me up on the offer, which was good because I wouldn't have enough time.

Right.

Like 30 people sign up or overly ambitious.

But the couple of folks that, that did sign up, it's great because we get to track that progress over time.

And I think the biggest thing is just being in the headspace of being able to be experimental.

So I'm not telling you and they're not telling me, hey, I'm gonna launch this company and build this app and I'm gonna quit my job and I'm gonna get this new job and blah, blah, blah.

I'm like, let's, like, let's dial it back.

What is the smallest executable thing that you can do today that's gonna get you.

Even if it's a centimeter closer to the thing that you wanna do?

Is it sending a text, Making a phone call, Sending an email?

Yeah.

Is it just.

Is it talking to your partner?

Like, what is that?

Like, pressure release valve that's gonna make you feel better so then you can keep going?

Yeah.

And being available, like with somebody over and over again like that, that's really, really helpful.

Totally.

Because you really have a thought partner.

Yeah.

To be with for that.

Totally.

And that's.

That's been my favorite part.

And that was what was missing, I think, from quote unquote.

Just.

And I, I don't say that to minimize anything that I'm about to say.

But.

I did not want to just do photography.

I didn't want to just write people's LinkedIn bios.

I didn't want to just write people's one liners.

I Didn't want to just do scheming sessions.

And now with field notes, it has been curated and created as a process so that we do this whole thing together.

And then afterwards we have one.

Depending on how we book out, we have one, if not two, if not three, integration calls.

Because it's so much more than just these photos.

It's so much more than this headshot.

Like, a headshot to me is a mirror.

I'm like, you could, you could take a, take a selfie and with AI, have a.

Honestly, a pretty good looking headshot at this point.

Yeah, I hate to say it, but you could.

What I want is to more.

So yeah, I'll be a mirror for you, but let's turn that mirror into a window.

I'll sit next to you and let's figure out, like, where are we going?

What are we doing?

Right?

And how can we take these photos of showing you and your element of where you're at in your happy place and this language and all this information that you gave me that I'm giving back to you in a new way.

I've had like these grown men.

I love this man.

He texted me yesterday.

He was like, I'm not crying.

You're crying.

I was like, that was the point.

And like, he's, he's a, he's a phenomenal business coach who has been doing this for hundreds and hundreds of people.

And the fact that, like, I can say something to him that he hasn't thought about, like, how cool is that?

Right?

Right.

That's really thoughtful.

Yeah.

And it, and it does, like, show that, you know, field notes is such a bigger project than just like a newsletter where you could learn about these people, you know?

Totally, totally.

Yeah, I love that.

Well, you know, as we wind down, I have some, like, fun questions that I wanted to ask you.

Let's do it.

And okay, if your creative process were a snack table, what would be on it?

Ooh, that is a fun one.

Yeah, Snack table.

For some reason, coconut water is coming up.

Okay.

It's like practical, like it's a necessity, but also is very hydrating and nourishing.

Like, you need that to keep going.

And chocolate.

I mean, what else do you need?

That sounds good.

Yeah, like dark chocolate with some sea salt.

Yes, that sounds good.

You take that, sit down and enjoy.

Exactly.

That's it.

Oh, my gosh.

Okay, so like my other question then.

If you could plan a three day creative retreat, no rules, where is it, what's happening, and who's there?

Oh, that's Such a good one.

That's such a good one.

My logistics brain is already going.

I'm like, but how do we do this?

We're sending out these invites right now.

Yeah, I'd probably say somewhere in, like, Central and.

Or South America.

Okay.

For sure.

I lived in Chile for a bit.

That's always like, calling me back and.

Or Costa Rica, for sure.

Just somewhere where, like, the people are so.

Just sweet and kind.

And I like being somewhere, like, I. I can speak Spanish relatively well, but I like being somewhere where I can't intake all of the information all the time.

So that would be helpful.

And I would invite the most, like, eclectic and, like, wildly diverse group of people that you could imagine, like, very intentionally.

But all of them would have a shared set of similar values in terms of being open and being kind, obviously, and being willing to see things from a different perspective so that, you know, we don't need to get into.

Into any.

Any issues along the way.

And I would bring a.

A friend who is a really epic facilitator.

It's always, like, really helpful to have that outside perspective to, like, keep bringing you back and bringing you back.

Yeah.

And the open mindness helps too.

For if somebody is, like, off track, like, nobody's gonna attack anybody, or like, look, I know where you're coming from.

Like, let's do talk like this or whatever.

Exactly, exactly.

And setting, like, the container for it and the parameters.

Cause I think that's the thing is, like, when you leave it, it's great to just, like, be out there and, like, flowing and hoping for the best.

But also it's great to ground people in a shared sense of purpose and.

Or wonder.

Yeah, for sure.

In my fellowship, we're always like.

Cause everybody's from all different backgrounds.

We're always like, look, when we speak, we know that the person isn't meaning to harm us in the way that they feel.

Exactly.

You know?

Yeah.

A hundred percent.

One hundred percent.

Okay.

And then my last question is, what's something silly or low stakes that's brought you big joy lately?

My dog.

Oh, come here.

What does it matter?

Say hi to Steph.

I think it's.

It's mostly.

It's very specific, like, yes, it's my dog, but it's the fact that he does this.

Like, he likes to be held like a child.

What a sweetheart.

And it's just.

It's so amusing to me.

And anytime that I'm sad, whether he's sleeping or not.

Cause I'm kind of a jerk, I just go over, and I scoop him up, and I'm like, this is what we need to do.

He's always down.

He's always down.

Lindsay's has her dog in the camera, which he is beautiful.

Oh, my gosh.

Well, Lindsay, is there anything else you.

Want to touch on before we call our conversation complete?

I mean, we've covered it all.

I do think that it's funny that we started talking about the Status Quo, because I actually.

And I don't know if I told you this, but I.

The original podcast that I had, the first podcast that I attempted, was called Cost of the Status Quo.

Oh, my goodness.

No, I didn't know that.

Yeah.

It was all about, like, why people do what they do, how they do it, which is very much like, has been a.

Clearly a common thread.

And I think that has always been in the back of my mind, which is what now field notes, I would argue is.

And we did a. I tried.

It was too much.

I don't like.

I don't like.

I don't like being told them too much.

I don't like telling other people they're too much.

I know.

That's right.

But this, admittedly, was a bit too much.

I.

We did a tour for Cost of the Status Quo, and it was called the Anti Networking.

Networking tour for people in projects you give a shit about.

Okay.

Which conceptually was lovely.

Yeah.

Then in execution, the idea was that if you combined movement, meaningful conversation, and music, what else do you need to have an amazing event?

Right.

I know a coconut water and chocolate's there.

That's what I'm saying.

Except when you try to do seven cities in seven days, you're like, look.

I could drive a tour bus.

You're really putting your skill set there.

I did seven cities, seven days.

In every single different city, we had a different movement practitioner, whether it was a yoga instructor or some sort of movement specialist, a dance instructor.

And so they led movement for the first, like, 10, 15 minutes.

And then I facilitated a conversation, and then we had a live musician at the end of every.

Every night.

And again, conceptually, this was a really epic and fantastic idea.

In reality, people were so confused.

They were like, but do I wear yoga pants?

Or is this casual?

Can I come from work?

Can I.

Like, there were so many questions.

And so ultimately, we ended up with, you know, anywhere between 25 to 50 people in each city, which was amazing.

Yes.

But it was very interesting to see.

We started in Chicago and worked our way back to the east coast, and it was very fascinating to.

To hear everyone's different, different perspectives and views and how those, how those all mesh together.

And it was great just to have that, that shared belief that there is, there is an issue with the status quo.

Yes.

Oh, my gosh.

I'm sure all those folks, they really enjoyed that you put that together for them.

Oh, what a time.

What a time.

Yeah, definitely.

What a time.

Also, I'm like, was your body super sore when you got home?

I think it's perpetually just yes, but no, other than that, man.

I just.

That's why I appreciate talking to you because you get to have a wide ranging conversation and I think that that shared sense of values and then being rooted in that, you know, headspace of doing no harm, I think is so, so beautiful and so important across the board.

Absolutely, absolutely.

You know, talking with Lindsay reminded me that field notes isn't really just a project.

It feels like it's more like an experience.

It feels experimental, therapeutic, almost like a life coaching session in the best way.

You know, like it's transformative work that makes you reflect on how we each define community, creativity and care.

And then you get these amazing photos as well.

I left this conversation feeling inspired to slow down and pay attention to like all the whole messy middle of that's going on and stay curious, to continue to be curious because that's really where all the good stuff lives.

And I really just appreciated bouncing around with Lindsay with all of these different ideas and I very, very much apprec you for going along the ride with me.

And I would love, love, love, love to know how you are defining community, creativity and care, especially right now.

Thank you so much for listening to Nosy AF today.

And yeah, I really, really hope to hear from you because you know, these are.

It's always something to think about and wrestle with all the time around here.

So yeah, thank you so much for listening and I will see you next time.

This has been another episode of Nosy af.

I'm your host, Stephanie Graham.

What did you think about today's conversation?

I would love to hear your thoughts.

Head over to the Nosy AF website for all the show notes related to this episode.

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Until next time, y' all stay curious and take care.

Bye.